fedora-infrastructure

#12831 Not receiving mail from users@lists.fedoraproject.org
Closed: Fixed with Explanation by kevin. Opened by francismontagnac.

Closed: Fixed with Explanation
Reopen Issue

I am missing most of the posts to the users list in my free.fr mailbox: only 16
posts received during this week, and with huge delays. The web interface shows
far more.posts.

Can you please check in your logs if free.fr was refusing those posts?
(see one example below).

Thanks.

If this is the case, I will contact the free.fr support.

This is not urgent: I can access the users list posts on its web interface.
(but this is not as practical for me).

I already did:

  • send emails to users-owner@lists.fedoraproject.org : no answer
  • add a topic to Ask Fedora:
    • https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/not-receiving-mail-from-users-lists-fedoraproject-org/167045
      (should I remove it ?)

Here is the last mail I sent to users-owner (this morning):

From: Francis Montagnac <francis.montagnac@free.fr>
To: users-owner@lists.fedoraproject.org
Subject: Re: Lost mails to users@lists.fedoraproject.org ?
Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2025 09:50:36 +0200
X-Mailer: Claws Mail 4.3.1 (GTK 3.24.49; x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu)
Hi.
I'm still missing most of the posts to the users list in my free.fr
mailbox: only 16 posts received during this week, and with huge
delays. The web interface shows far more.posts.
Can you please check your logs if free.fr was refusing those posts?
Thanks.
If this is the case, I will contact the free.fr support.
One example:
    ## Initial post and Message-ID
    Received: from mailman01.rdu3.fedoraproject.org (mailman01.rdu3.fedoraproject.org [10.16.163.57]) by bastion01.rdu3.fedoraproject.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3C848B24A; Thu,  2 Oct 2025 03:04:21 +0000 (UTC)
    Message-ID: <2cefa7c9-9aa5-4641-a6df-b65eb5bd2eb6@sieb.net>
    ## Received by free.fr: around 3 days later
    Received: from bastion.fedoraproject.org ([38.145.32.11]) by mx1-g20.free.fr (MXproxy) with ESMTPS for francis.montagnac@free.fr (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256); Sun,  5 Oct 2025 04:59:33 +0200 (CEST)
    ## free.fr spam tags: not a SPAM
    X-ProXaD-SC: state=HAM score=0
    X-ProXaD-Cause: [...]
    X-ProXaD-Context:
    ## web URL
    Archived-At: <https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/SZPE76EPRVJCUUEULV7R3W7WWX5YDUKN/>
    ## Standard headers
    From: Samuel Sieb <samuel@sieb.net>
    To: users@lists.fedoraproject.org
    Subject: Re: "bare metal" installation
    Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2025 20:04:11 -0700
    Reply-To: Community support for Fedora users <users@lists.fedoraproject.org>
PS: I made also this post on Ask Fedora, but did not get any answer:
    https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/not-receiving-mail-from-users-lists-fedoraproject-org/167045
    Excerpt:
        I even unsubscribed then subscribed again yesterday to no avail.
        In addition, I saw yesterday that I have 2 subscriptions to
        the users list:
          https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/accounts/subscriptions/
          List Name                              Subscription Address         Delivery Mode   Role
          [...]
          users.lists.fedoraproject.org          francis.montagnac@free.fr    regular         member
          users.lists.fedoraproject.org          francis.montagnac@free.fr    None            nonmember
        Is this the problem ?
        After unsubscribing the “nonmember” subscription remained, and
        I was not offered to unsubscribe a second time.
On Tue, 30 Sep 2025 08:12:13 +0200
Francis Montagnac <francis.montagnac@free.fr> wrote:
> Hi.
> 
> On Mon, 29 Sep 2025 08:33:54 +0200
> Francis Montagnac <francis.montagnac@free.fr> wrote:
>   
> > I sent a message to the users@lists.fedoraproject.org more than one
> > hour ago, but it has not reached my mailbox and is not present in the
> > web interface of this list.    
> 
> This message reached the web interface:
> 
>   https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/LZP3EDVXO7CHPOL2ZX2J47Q2VR7FR2HR/
> 
> but not my mailbox, as well as all the (few) messages sent yesterday
> to this list.
> 
> My ISP used to tag messages to this list as spam. Can you check if you
> see traces of that in your logs ?
> 
> Thanks.
>    
> > Is it a problem on my side (or my ISP) or on the list server ?
> > 
> > Thanks.
> > 
> > Details.
> > 
> > Message-ID: <20250929071158.525f88bb@fmpc>
> > From: Francis Montagnac <francis.montagnac@free.fr>
> > To: Patrick Dupre via users <users@lists.fedoraproject.org>
> > Cc: Patrick Dupre <pdupre@gmx.com>
> > Subject: Re: Issue with Virtual machine
> > Date: Mon, 29 Sep 2025 07:11:58 +0200
> > 
> > postfix related maillog on my PC:
> > 
> > Sep 29 07:11:58 fmpc postfix/smtpd[106823]: connect from localhost[::1]
> > Sep 29 07:11:58 fmpc postfix/smtpd[106823]: 983A725C39C: client=localhost[::1]
> > Sep 29 07:11:58 fmpc postfix/cleanup[106827]: 983A725C39C: message-id=<20250929071158.525f88bb@fmpc>
> > Sep 29 07:11:58 fmpc postfix/qmgr[1554]: 983A725C39C: from=<francis.montagnac@free.fr>, size=1887, nrcpt=2 (queue active)
> > Sep 29 07:11:58 fmpc postfix/smtpd[106823]: disconnect from localhost[::1] ehlo=2 starttls=1 mail=1 rcpt=2 data=1 quit=1 commands=8
> > Sep 29 07:12:00 fmpc postfix/smtp[106828]: 983A725C39C: to=<pdupre@gmx.com>, relay=smtp.free.fr[2a01:e0c:1::25]:25, delay=1.5, delays=0.05/0.03/0.13/1.2, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (250 2.0.0 Ok: queued as D17AA2003C6)
> > Sep 29 07:12:00 fmpc postfix/smtp[106828]: 983A725C39C: to=<users@lists.fedoraproject.org>, relay=smtp.free.fr[2a01:e0c:1::25]:25, delay=1.5, delays=0.05/0.03/0.13/1.2, dsn=2.0.0, status=sent (250 2.0.0 Ok: queued as D17AA2003C6)
> > Sep 29 07:12:00 fmpc postfix/qmgr[1554]: 983A725C39C: removed
> > 
> > IMO my ISP (free.fr) is fine: I did a successful test at 07:45
> > 
> > Web interface of this thread:
> > 
> > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org/thread/KD52LNAC4E4TZZWTZCZYCAV7XKZIRJTO/#2DDYKKACUEXLMQGXH7KL7MZLQHIN57AD
> > Last message: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/JJ4C6H4CEJCINEEDGCCE6TCELJUEULKJ/
> >               28 Sep 2025 3:13 p.m
> > 
> > I posted successfully yesterday:
> > 
> >   https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/users@lists.fedoraproject.org/message/2DDYKKACUEXLMQGXH7KL7MZLQHIN57AD/  
-- 
francis

hello.

I actually replied to you a number of times, but it seems my laptop was having problems (postfix was no longer running), so the emails didn't go anywhere. :(
Sorry about that.

I have fixed that and you should see a number of replies.

Basically your isp is saying:

host mx2.free.fr[212.27.42.58] refused to talk to me: 421 Too many errors from your IP (38.145.32.11), please visit http://postmaster.free.fr/)

The page referred to just says 'make sure you don't have any problems and wait'

I am not aware of any sending problems with any other domain.

francismontagnac commented

Hi.

I updated this morning the Ask Fedora topic:

https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/not-receiving-mail-from-users-lists-fedoraproject-org/167045

For memory, I said:

> host mx2.free.fr[212.27.42.58] refused to talk to me: 421 Too many errors from your IP (38.145.32.11), please visit http://postmaster.free.fr/)
I asked the free.fr support to explain that and also to whitelist fedoraproject.org
(since bastion01.rdu3.fedoraproject.org is using SpamAssassin and with a SPF authentification)

I suggest to follow up this problem (personal, too specific) in this issue instead of in the Ask
Fedora topic.

Do you agree ?

If yes, it would be better to remove the topic but I don't think I have the rights to do that.

I actually replied to you a number of times, but it seems my laptop was having problems (postfix
was no longer running), so the emails didn't go anywhere. :(

May be related to: https://discussion.fedoraproject.org/t/dnf-system-upgrade-disables-services-when-upgrading/167187/14

I have fixed that and you should see a number of replies.

None at the moment, as of Mon Oct 6 08:30:28 AM UTC 2025, but never mind: not really fancy to
attempt solving email problems using ... emails :-)
francismontagnac commented

I got an answer from free.fr.

    Here are the stats of established SMTP sessions from 38.145.32.11 :
    Sep 22 :  273 SMTP sessions,  292 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 23 :  153 SMTP sessions,  162 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 24 :  194 SMTP sessions,  206 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 25 :  200 SMTP sessions,  234 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 26 :  743 SMTP sessions,  770 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 27 :  212 SMTP sessions,  245 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 28 :  758 SMTP sessions,  764 RCPT TO,    0 do not exist ( 0.00%)
    Sep 29 : 1006 SMTP sessions, 1007 RCPT TO, 1001 do not exist (99.40%)
    Sep 30 :  384 SMTP sessions,  386 RCPT TO,  382 do not exist (98.96%)
    Oct  1 :  465 SMTP sessions,  467 RCPT TO,  449 do not exist (96.15%)
    Oct  2 :  454 SMTP sessions,  459 RCPT TO,  441 do not exist (96.08%)
    Oct  3 :  496 SMTP sessions,  508 RCPT TO,  449 do not exist (88.39%)
    Oct  4 :  529 SMTP sessions,  561 RCPT TO,  441 do not exist (78.61%)
    Oct  5 :  198 SMTP sessions,  230 RCPT TO,   52 do not exist (22.61%)
    Oct  6 :   21 SMTP sessions,   22 RCPT TO,    3 do not exist (13.64%)
    This IP has been blocked due to a too high ratio of mails to unknown
    recipients.
    The main sender of those mails is:
      package-announce-bounces@lists.fedoraproject.org
    There were a single unknown recipient (a compromised account blocked
    as of Sep 28)
    I feel that there has been a loop between the sender and our SMTP
    servers

Those stats are coherent to what I saw: no more reliable mails since
Mon Sep 29.

He did not gave me the name of the compromised account :-(

Can you look at the mail queue on bastion01 and suppress the bogus
related messages ?

Adjust may be also the configuration of the package-announce* lists

Thanks.
Edited by francismontagnac

Metadata Update from @james:
- Issue assigned to kevin
- Issue tagged with: low-gain, low-trouble

Metadata Update from @james:
- Issue priority set to: Waiting on Assignee (was: Needs Review)

ok. I found a user who started getting:

relay=mx1.free.fr[212.27.48.6]:25, delay=3.8, delays=0.12/1.5/1.1/1.1, dsn=5.1.1, status=bounced (host mx1.free.fr[212.27.48.6] said: 550 5.1.1 user unknown (UserSearch) (in reply to RCPT TO command))

on the 28th.

So, I wanted to look at the bounce to see why mailman didn't just unsubscribe them, but... I mailed that address and it was accepted.
So, I am confused here why it was giving a user unknown when they appear to be known. ;(

In any case I have unsubscribed them from all lists. They were already unsubscribed from package-announce however.

francismontagnac commented

Good, but did you cleaned the mail queue on bastion01 ?

I think no, because free.fr blacklisted again bastion01 today (Sep 7)
around 4 oclock UTC.

You can check that as follows:

  • go to https://postmaster.free.fr/
  • Mon IP est elle bloquée ?
    • enter in the form: 38.145.32.11
    • click on rechercher

That gives around 07:08 CEST (05:08 UTC):

`L'IP 38.145.32.11 est blacklistée pour une duré de 82255s (too many errors (unexisting recipients, broken connections), testing)`

thus the (24 hours) blacklist will end at:

    TZ=UTC date -d 'now + 82255 seconds'
    Wed Oct  8 03:59:39 AM UTC 2025

Tell me please when this cleanup is done. I will then ask the
free.fr admins to suppress the blacklist of bastion01.

Thanks.
Edited by francismontagnac
francismontagnac commented

Hi. Still blacklisted today, until 08:35:01 AM UTC

TZ=UTC date
Wed Oct  8 04:38:31 AM UTC 2025
## L'IP 38.145.32.11 est blacklistée pour une duré de 14190s (too many errors (unexisting recipients, broken connections), testing)
TZ=UTC date -d 'now + 14190 seconds'
Wed Oct  8 08:35:01 AM UTC 2025
francismontagnac commented

Some progress: bastion01 has not being blacklisted since this morning
Oct 8 08:35:01 AM UTC (as of Oct 8 03:09:50 PM UTC, ie after more than
6 hours).

However I only received since (from bastion01):

No mails from the users list, for example no mail from this new thread:
- Samsung NVMe with 4K LBA - anybody?

Is this normal ?

PS: It would be far better IMO, that the dates of the posts at
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/ be in UTC and giving
always the day, not only the time.

In addition they are wrong for example for the above thread:
  - initial post: 8 Oct 2025 8:11 a.m.
  - first reply:  8 Oct 3:52 a.m (before the initial post)
  - second reply: 4:33 a.m (before the initial post)
(I known that passing the mouse on those dates shows the sender's
time, but without giving the timezone).

Update: a Shift Refresh of this page (from firefox) corrected the
wrong 8:11 a.m. to 3:11 a.m
Edited by francismontagnac

Sorry for the delay, I have been busy with higher priority items.

I don't see any mails to free.fr in the queue anymore.

Your email to in the users list got disabled by mailman.
If you login to lists.fedoraproject.org and go to your profile and the list you can set it back on there.
I went ahead and enabled it now.

For the dates issue, probibly best to get upstream to do that and we can get it in an update:
https://gitlab.com/mailman/hyperkitty

So, with that are things back to all working? Will keep this open to confirm/make sure...

francismontagnac commented

Your email to in the users list got disabled by mailman.

Ok. That explain what I saw yesterday.

If you login to lists.fedoraproject.org and go to your profile and
the list you can set it back on there.
I went ahead and enabled it now.

Thanks.

However, I still see the wrong/ghost/duplicate nonmember entry at:
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/accounts/subscriptions/

    You are subscribed to the following mailing lists:
    List Name                      Subscription Address       Delivery Mode   Role
    [snip devel accounts]
    users.lists.fedoraproject.org  francis.montagnac@free.fr  regular         member
    users.lists.fedoraproject.org  francis.montagnac@free.fr  None            nonmember

It would be nice if you could suppress it, but this is not important.

So, with that are things back to all working?

It seems yes: I received again emails to the users list this morning,
and with no delay.

Will keep this open to confirm/make sure...

Thanks.

I've tried to delete that nonmember entry, but mailman just times out trying to process it. ;(

I'll see if I can find a workaround, but I guess we can close this now?

Metadata Update from @kevin:
- Issue close_status updated to: Fixed with Explanation
- Issue status updated to: Closed (was: Open)
francismontagnac commented

Hi.

All is fine, this issue can stay closed:

  • free.fr hasn't blacklisted bastion01 since Wednesday
  • I'm still receiving emails from the users list since your last action on mailman

I commented on Ask Fedora

Thanks for your help.

Metadata Update from @francismontagnac:
- Issue status updated to: Open (was: Closed)
francismontagnac commented

Sorry for this reopen.

I'm almost sure to have used Comment and not Comment & Reopen :-(

No worries. Thanks for your patience with this and provding all the info!

Metadata Update from @kevin:
- Issue close_status updated to: Fixed with Explanation
- Issue status updated to: Closed (was: Open)
Metadata

low-gain low-trouble

None
None
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