we've worked on this before
https://pagure.io/design/issue/576

but i dont think got to a useful conclusion unfortunately. do any of the mockups there appeal

Any of those are nice :thumbsup: I was thinking a rainbow background, behind the infinity, would work well for the rounded border profile picture size. The final image should be exported as a square PNG with equal height and width, so can be reused on multiple platforms and maintain the same appearance after cropping.

Hi Sirko, could you please clarify why this ticket is closed as invalid?

a LOGO is a LOGO and stays like it is

I think it's all explained here:

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Logo/UsageGuidelines#Never_Switch_the_Colors

Remember Fedora logo (the image) has a trademark, and also has a Guidelines we must follow. The diverse iterations of the logo are only based on individual elements of the logo itself, mostly the bubble.

I think there could be a pride-flag-bubble (without the infinity and F) but again, would be best to check with legal if that could proceed.

I see. In the future, an explanation is helpful. When this ticket is closed as invalid without an explanation, it makes me feel like this request is being ignored because it is about the Pride flag and discrimination against the LGBTQ+ community. Other tickets about rainbow variants of the Fedora logo were closed before, but we do modify backgrounds on other Fedora logo variants, like below.

So, we can change this request without breaking logo usage guidelines. I am asking for the logo to be used on a rainbow background. I want to use this for a chat group for LGBTQ+ identifying people in Fedora. Could someone help me understand what is against the rules if we are only changing the background, not modifying the logo?

The Red Hat logo branding guidelines mentioned rainbow colors for the Red Hat Pride community as acceptable. Why can we not do the same thing for Fedora?

https://www.redhat.com/en/about/brand/standards/color

For awareness, trademark guidelines Maria is referring to: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Legal:Trademark_guidelines

There is probably a way to do it Justin, it just has to be done in a way that doesn't upset legal.

Looks like the request is in compliance to me.

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Legal:Trademark_guidelines#Community_sites_and_accounts

Agreed.

@gnokii and @tatica are correct that this isn't allowed in the logo guidelines - but if you look at the earlier ticket I referenced in the first comment, the council was OK with that previously (and they have the authority to allow it), they just wanted to have the opportunity to approve the design. So I think it's better to keep this ticket open for the design, and we can open a council ticket to get approval for it to be used.

@jflory7 I'll post a proposal shortly, can you handle taking it to the council noting I was the one who designed it?

@jflory7 and just to answer your question req the badger vs this.... IANAL but have been involved in a number of these types of issues - so it's my understanding that because the Fedora f with the rainbow is being used as a mark itself, it sort of triggers trademark concerns. Vs. the badger artwork, which is integrating the trademark unmodified into a composition (which we allow with design team approval in the logo guidelines.) The Fedora Design Team can allow exceptions to the guidelines in an artwork context (putting the unmodified logo on a wallpaper background, putting it on a banner for Fedora magazine, etc.) but we cannot approve any modifications to the core logo components (bubble, f, infinity, colors, letter shape, etc. outlined in the guidelines) without council andor Red Hat approval.

(this is also why I believe the trademark guidelines you cited don't come into play because those assume an unmodified trademark)

@jflory7 oh, one other thing. so the mark you posted that is being used in matrix & telegram is in fact a violation of the logo guidelines - it drops the bubble which is a core logo element, it also drops the TM mark. I understand why it's done that way, but it isn't permitted in our guidelines. I don't know if you've gotten the OK already to do that.

Everything I suggested above - getting perms from the council, that this is a modification of the trademark and thus triggers a set of exception granting - is under the assumption that what you are looking for is the same mark as you posted, but replacing the blue background with a rainbow one.

IF you are ok keeping the blue Fedora bubble and simply placing it on a rainbow background (which is what was done in the mockups in the old ticket), there is no exception to be granted, that falls under the standard Fedora Design Team discretion and I would absolutely approve it.

So it depends which way you want to go. I'll mock both up. But in either case we should make sure the mark that's already in use is either compliant or get the OK to use it (which I don't think would be difficult.)

Hope this helps.

Ok, now this might be the most helpful since there's visuals that hopefully make some of the issues here more clear.

Here is the current design you are using in the general sense, with a Pride design following the same layout. To note: the Fedora pride colors that were developed for the earlier ticket's flag design are from the official Fedora color palette which I think is a good thing to make sure this appears well integrated with Fedora and not just slapping the logo on a generic rainbow. However. Because of the intensity and brightness of the colors, following this layout doesn't even work without modification to the rainbow - here I've added a dark Fedora blue gradient in the back (we try to avoid dropshadows with the logo elements) but it still doesn't read cleanly. Aside from trademark issues and headache that causes, this visual implementation issue is why I would definitely not recommend this approach:

Ok so this set of designs adjusts the existing generic Fedora design to meet the guidelines and still read OK in a circular-clipping situation, and then extends that layout to the Fedora pride rainbow. This is what I'd recommend going forward with. Even better, it just requires design team level approval (you have my approval) so there's no legwork of getting approvals from the Council to use it, and it doesn't trigger any sort of trademark exceptions yadda yadda. You'll note I also added the TM back into it:

Let me know if you'd like to move forward with the recommended design and I can post a clean SVG and PNG. (I did it at 640x640px like your original file but can scale up or down as you'd like!)

@duffy I love the versions you recommend! +1

No need for this. Fedora should be apolitical. We just need one logo. Changing background etc etc is not so called "variant of Fedora logo". The title is misleading..

opensource community should be neutral and stay away from political views, religious views, sexual orientation.

checked https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/diversity-inclusion/ and I did't see LGBTQ on the list.

Please keep it yourself. Close the ticket!

@robbinespu this is a design team ticket for design team members to work with requestors on their issues. I agree that the ticket title about creating a logo variant caused a little bit of the confusion in this ticket, but the rest of your comment is incorrect: the fedora council has already expressed support for this team to provide graphics for our LGBTQ community members to use in conjunction with fedora marks as noted in this ticket.

I find a statement like "please keep it to yourself" to be hurtful. The very first sentence of the D+I document you linked to says

"The Fedora Project welcomes and encourages participation by everyone."

"Everyone" includes our LGBTQ Fedora friends!

@jflory7 are you set here? anything else needed?

Hey @duffy, the mock-ups look great! This is exactly what I was looking for. Let me know how to help move this forward.

@jflory7 cool if you are OK with the recommended designs I'll slice 'em out and export for you and post here. If you wouldn't mind updating the pre-existing fedora plain logos as well I'd really appreciate that so they're compliant with the guidelines. Expect the files to be posted here by COB today

@duffy Oops I missed that part in the above. I don't have rights in all the groups where the clipped logos are used, but for the ones I do have admin rights, I can update them too. :thumbsup: I'll keep an eye out for the exported images :)

Thanks Mo!

@jflory7

Sorry for the delay! Here's the files. Can you let me know which communities that use the old generic one that you don't have admin that you are aware of, so I can find them and find the admins to replace with the new generic one?

[see https://pagure.io/design/issue/683#comment-664453 below for updated assets]

@duffy Twitter recommends 1500×500 for header images. I made one where i just extended the flag bars by 1000 to each side from the square version, but it looks less-than-great. Suggestions?

@mattdm here is some playing around. (Also we need to fix the twitter avatar to be complaint :) ) but since the logo is already in the avatar circle, it's kind of redunant to have it on the rainbow bg. So I would recommend for this usage specifically just the rainbow. What do you think?

I was looking at putting this for my personal twitter banner (for a while at least -- I've been stuck on the F26 wallpaper and it's probably time to move on). :)

https://twitter.com/mattdm :)

@mattdm looks good! i like it :)

@duffy These are amazing, thanks so much! :heart_eyes: I updated all groups where I had access. I don't have a list of ones where I don't or else I would have changed them. Groups like Fedora Mindshare, the official Fedora group, and maybe a handful of others are left.

There are 70+ rooms on Matrix that I can work on updating but I will chip away on them over time :sweat_smile:

And a CommBlog post would be amazing!! :rainbow:

These fix a tiny alignment issue.

The Fedora colors are in the https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Logo/UsageGuidelines so if you need to use this for print be sure to note the CMYK in the guidelines.

I am moving the plain fedora logo design to issue #686 - and I am going to close out this ticket. Cheers!