11:14:27        dustymabe | #topic coordinating default/fallback hostname changes 
11:14:27               -- | zodbot has changed topic for #fedora-meeting-1 from "Action items from
                          | last meeting (Meeting topic: fedora_cloud_meeting)" to "coordinating
                          | default/fallback hostname changes  (Meeting topic:
                          | fedora_cloud_meeting)"
11:15:01          davdunc | Is that handled in cloud-init?
11:15:11        dustymabe | A little background...
11:15:15          davdunc | :) 
11:15:18        dustymabe | Back in Fedora 33 the default hostname was changed from localhost to
                          | fedora on instances that didn't get the hostname set in any other way
                          | (i.e. it's the fallback if it's not set anywhere else). As far as I
                          | know this change came in in systemd and was never proposed as a change
                          | in Fedora itself.
11:15:38          davdunc | i see. 
11:15:44        dustymabe | Here's the original enablement upstream
                          | https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/5175 and the BZ requesting the
                          | change in Fedora: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1392925
11:16:02        dustymabe | Unfortunately, this initiallly caused us in FCOS some pain because
                          | setting the hostname via reverse DNS lookups (via NetworkManager)
                          | stopped working along with breaking 3rd party tools that set the
                          | hostname. The NM problem was subsequently fixed, but it still remains
                          | that a lot of third party software will check to see if an instance's
                          | hostname is "unset" by checking the current hostname
11:16:02        dustymabe | against the string "localhost". Additionally it even seems that this
                          | change will never be picked up by CentOS/RHEL (see https://src.fedorapr
                          | oject.org/rpms/systemd/c/13d1341b108a24d13f5922054307b5c2efc6836a?branc
                          | h=rawhide).
11:16:19          davdunc | eww. 
11:16:35        dustymabe | The open question is, what do we think the fallback hostname should be
                          | for server like instances? And.. Should we do anything to change it for
                          | a subset of Editions/Working Groups in Fedora?
11:17:42          davdunc | so... just thinking here, and I am happy to be wrong, but what is wrong
                          | with "fedora" for all of them.
11:17:44          davdunc | ? 
11:18:17          davdunc | if we are setting a default, I wouldn't think that we would want it to
                          | deviate much, if at all.
11:18:22          mhayden | perhaps we could use "deprecate-legacy-bios" as the hostname? 🤭
11:18:28          davdunc | LOL
11:18:31          mhayden | but yes "fedora" would be a decent suggestion
11:18:39        dustymabe | davdunc: the main problem with it is the assumptions that other
                          | software/tools make   
11:18:57          davdunc | i expected as much. 
11:19:15               -- | feborges[m] is now known as feborges_afk[m]
11:19:19          davdunc | so localhost ends up being the typical expectations
11:19:21        dustymabe | we hit this in openshift where tools were checking "if `localhost`; 
                          | then set hostname to xyzfoo" 
11:19:45        dustymabe | the problem with `fedora` is it's hard to know if someone set that 
                          | hostname intentionally or not
11:20:01          davdunc | indeed. 
11:20:23          davdunc | though from the cloud perspective, it's our default username for every
                          | platform, etc. 
11:20:28        dustymabe | there is tooling around that (hostnamectl), but a lot of scripts/tools
                          | don't use it 
11:20:54          davdunc | yea. clearly the OpenShift decision was to look for the expected. 
11:21:19          davdunc | And that code review had a lot of senior eyes on it, I am sure.  
11:21:35        dustymabe | which code review? 
11:21:58          davdunc | the one that let that "if `localhost` . . . " get through. 
11:22:03        dustymabe | :) 
11:22:14        dustymabe | well the thing is, that's the case for RHEL
11:22:18        dustymabe | and RHCOS
11:22:31        dustymabe | see https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/systemd/c/13d1341b108a24d13f5922
                          | 054307b5c2efc6836a?branch=rawhide 
11:23:30          davdunc | yes and that proves that anything else but localhost is getting a
                          | kneejerk retooling.
11:24:10        dustymabe | davdunc: right.. IOW you're saying it caused problems and downstream
                          | immediately changed it back? 
11:24:25          davdunc | okay... I am seeing how "fedora" is a great fit for workstation, but
                          | maybe not anywhere else... 
11:24:30        dustymabe | exactly
11:24:55          davdunc | I feel like I am coming around to your way of thinking
11:25:27        dustymabe | The current proposal is that we should work to get back to the
                          | default/fallback being `localhost` for Cloud WG. This matches what FCOS
                          | is currently doing (see
                          | https://github.com/coreos/fedora-coreos-tracker/issues/902)
11:25:52        dustymabe | Depending on the level of buy in we can achieve that goal together
11:26:02          davdunc | okay. Let's put an issue in and then I'll add it to the technical
                          | specification. 
11:26:12        dustymabe | ok I can open an issue
11:26:17          davdunc | super. 
11:26:20              --> | Renault_ (Charles-Antoine Couret)
                          | (~Renault@2a02:578:85c6:1101:619d:6645:6a1c:53d6) has joined
                          | #fedora-meeting-1
11:26:31        dustymabe | and we can vote/comment there on merits 
11:26:38        dustymabe | mhayden: any thoughts on $topic?
11:27:04          davdunc | he gave us his legacy-bios naming preference!
11:27:12          mhayden | i tend to agree with you, dustymabe -- `localhost` makes sense to me